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Reeve
NaBraniel
Posts: 29,913
Registered: ‎11-26-2004
0

American decline.

[ Edited ]

Has anyone actually watched these types of videos?

 

http://www.moneynews.com/StreetTalk/Aftershock-survival-summit-un
thinkable/2011/10/06/id/413486
  

 

The Dow Jones’ MarketWatch said, “Aftershock will teach you how to protect yourself against an increasingly hostile Wall Street-Corporate-America-Washington conspiracy undermining average stock market investors. This is your bible, read it, get into action, and be a winner.”

And, the S&P calls Wiedemer’s work “a compelling argument for a chilling conclusion. [His] track record demands our attention.”


http://pro.stansberryresearch.com/1202ENDOFAMR/6PSIN285/  -- the video those cryptic "NewAmerica4" television commercials advertise on cable at night.

 

Been seeing these types of videos/books/economic survival plans advertised for maybe a year now on television and internet ads. Fear-mongering designed to sell something, right? I've wholly ignored them until now, am bored enough to be ~20 minutes into the second video, a lot of fiscal conservative "our way of life is wholly unsustainable too much anti-business over-regulation the Fed is sketch" sort of stuff, tl;dr the dollar will be replaced as the world's reserve currency, I'm not knowledgable enough to dispute any of it. If you are, feel free.

 

Regardless. How much longer do you see American life being anything like it is now and has been for decades? For whatever reason your particular lean of things grants you to cite, do you think the generalquality of life will, at least temporarily, decline in any significant way in the semi-near future? Do you think we as people who have been around longer than any other people will work something out, either through existing power structures or new ones, to combat this? What do you think daily life will look like for the average American (who statistically is lower class) in the relatively near future? Do you think the wealthiest country on Earth rapidly and significantly declining in wealth and power will somehow unite the world, most of which lives significantly worse off than us, and embrace some new system of getting #### done? Will things more or less resume as they have been when we come out on the other side of any hypothetical crisis, or will it be time for a New World Order?

 

 

You are welcome to get on a soap box about anything, just try not to terrible it up by harping on socialism or "the Republicans" very too much.

Muslim brotherhood
SwimPWNED
BackupAlt
Posts: 4,233
Registered: ‎12-20-2011
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63829401

SwimHELPeR
DoomsDayDevice
Posts: 12,319
Registered: ‎05-23-2008
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63829401


NaBraniel wrote:

Has anyone actually watched these types of videos?

 

http://www.moneynews.com/StreetTalk/Aftershock-survival-summit-un
thinkable/2011/10/06/id/413486
  

 

The Dow Jones’ MarketWatch said, “Aftershock will teach you how to protect yourself against an increasingly hostile Wall Street-Corporate-America-Washington conspiracy undermining average stock market investors. This is your bible, read it, get into action, and be a winner.”

And, the S&P calls Wiedemer’s work “a compelling argument for a chilling conclusion. [His] track record demands our attention.”


http://pro.stansberryresearch.com/1202ENDOFAMR/6PSIN285/  -- the video those cryptic "NewAmerica4" television commercials advertise on cable at night.

 

Been seeing these types of videos/books/economic survival plans advertised for maybe a year now on television and internet ads. Fear-mongering designed to sell something, right? I've wholly ignored them until now, am bored enough to be ~20 minutes into the second video, a lot of fiscal conservative "our way of life is wholly unsustainable too much anti-business over-regulation the Fed is sketch" sort of stuff, tl;dr the dollar will be replaced as the world's reserve currency, I'm not knowledgable enough to dispute any of it. If you are, feel free.

 

Regardless. How much longer do you see American life being anything like it is now and has been for decades? For whatever reason your particular lean of things grants you to cite, do you think the generalquality of life will, at least temporarily, decline in any significant way in the semi-near future? Do you think we as people who have been around longer than any other people will work something out, either through existing power structures or new ones, to combat this? What do you think daily life will look like for the average American (who statistically is lower class) in the relatively near future? Do you think the wealthiest country on Earth rapidly and significantly declining in wealth and power will somehow unite the world, most of which lives significantly worse off than us, and embrace some new system of getting #### done? Will things more or less resume as they have been when we come out on the other side of any hypothetical crisis, or will it be time for a New World Order?

 

 

You are welcome to get on a soap box about anything, just try not to terrible it up by harping on socialism or "the Republicans" very too much.


I don't understand what you mean by what I highlighted.

 

Also, global economy, blah blah blah, if one of the major world economies collapses, we all go down with them. Except for that pesky "1%." They'll be fine.

IMMA RAIN HOT DOOM DOWN UPON YOU!


Visit The Pillow Fort


You're dead to me.

Order of the Kitty
KnightStar
Posts: 60,995
Registered: ‎07-21-2003
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63829401

All I believe things like that are is sensationalism wrapped in a conspiracy theory used to sell a product.

Just like the History Channel uses fear about the 2012 Apocalypse to push an almost constant stream of on air Nostradamus and Mayan 2012 related material.

TOMOE242004
"It is a journey into the male mind, in which I believe is really a potentially funny place cause lets face it, nothing happens there." -Andy Wilman Top Gear Producer-

"What will be will, what won't....won't." -Kamina-

"The only person that ever looked good in a four seated convertible was Adolph Hitler!" -Jeremy Clarkson-

"Ha! Sanity, what would I do with something as useless as that?" "Good thing I never had use for such a thing." -Zaraki Kenpatchi-

"I've never seen a ship like this before. It's far behind any C'tarl-C'tarl ship. It won't move unless you're naked! That's very kinky, wouldn't you say? -Aisha Clanclan-

"Well it was the least I could do for you, actually the least I could have done was run away and stick my head in a gopher hole." -Griffin Kato-

"Nothing good can ever come from staying with normal people." -Harry McDougal-


Reeve
NaBraniel
Posts: 29,913
Registered: ‎11-26-2004
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to DoomsDayDevice - Message ID#: 63829479

Just a way of saying we have all of human history behind us to analyze and learn from. The human factor... will our large population of literate twenty-first century men and women, with our formal schooling and array of widely available information and ability to reason, be able to deftly avoid or navigate through future major societal problems and emerge as unscathed as one could reasonably hope for, or are we, despite all of our technological and humanitarian progression, not at a special enough time in human development to overcome the usual high hurdles of coexisting.
Muslim brotherhood
Reeve
NaBraniel
Posts: 29,913
Registered: ‎11-26-2004
0

Re: American decline.

[ Edited ]

Reply to KnightStar - Message ID#: 63829487

I feel similarly, although someone attempting to profit from economic predictions does not necessarily nullify those predictions.

 

 

I've been listening to the video drone on all this time and it finally dropped the always hilarious "THE LESS PEOPLE WHO KNOW ABOUT THIS THE BETTER" line.

Muslim brotherhood
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rotanalebor
Posts: 10,022
Registered: ‎02-16-2004

Re: American decline.

[ Edited ]

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63829401

Honestly, I think we're screwed. When adjusted for inflation Individual earnings for the majority of Americans have been stagnant for decades. While our country's GDP has grown substantially over that time almost all the gains went to the top few percent and income inequality is the worst since the Gilded Age as a result. The effects of this have been partially masked for a while by rising household income (as more members of the family entered the workforce), cheap credit, and relatively low price inflation, but I think we've reached the effective limit of these. Without some real and sustained growth in median wages I don't see how we can return to a healthy economy.

We're not facing apocalyptic scenario where we're all forced to horde water and grow our own food, but I can see 7-8% unemployment and low labor participation rates being the "new normal." Even if we do manage to somehow get back to full employment, we'll find ourselves increasingly becoming a nation of low-wage service employees with more and more of us relying on gov't assistance (tax credits, food stamps, insurance subsidies) just stay out of poverty.

I don't know how we turn the tide at this point, but the Republican cure-all, lowering taxes for rich, is ridiculous. 30 years of historically low taxes on income and capital gains for the richest Americans have brought us to where we are today. Plus they want to cut benefits for the poor and those on fixed incomes, AND they want to "broaden the base" by raising taxes on the poor? Yeah, reducing aggregate demand by the slashing discretionary income of those most likely to spend will surely get the economy booming! /sarcasm

I wish the Democrats actually had a plan for treating the disease instead of the symptoms. Obamacare, payroll tax cuts, and expanding food stamps and unemployment are all well and good in the short-term, but they don't address the long-term issues that make these programs necessary: the middle class is dying.
yes
Swimmortal
westpark
Posts: 59,269
Registered: ‎10-26-2005

Re: American decline.

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63829401

A lot of the Ron Paul type gold standard kooks are onto something real & serious. They are right, we will lose our reserve currency status. Does that mean the end of the world? No.

 

If you go to Mexico or Brazil or South Africa or Thailand even though they have lots of poverty & a ####ty currency they still have KFCs, grocery stores, movie theaters, gas stations, McDonalds, & a whole slew of other American-type lifestyle places.

 

That being said, we SHOULDN'T go back to a gold standard but that doesn't mean we shouldn't be doing a far more aggressive Federal Reserve interest rate policy. Inflation is horrible, not matter how intense crackpot neoliberal & neocon economists assert it doesn't exist. That being said the problem isn't fiat money -- but how the govt is printing that money & the structure of our economy. What the Federal Reserve is trying to do is this -- its trying to monetize & print away a lot of the debts & obligations we have. And that's fine. It works, for now.

 

The problem is -- it can only work for so long. We're good til probably the end of the decade. Having an easy money policy as we have now is only good for an export driven economy. We are a consumption based economy & consimption only works decent when your currency is strong.

 

Things will get worse, there will be fewer jobs & unless you get some kind of technical training, it won't be a gravy train finding steady well-paying work, unless you're lucky or connected somehow.

 

That being said this guy & the other 'Stansberry video' both are just alarmist. Even if the #### hits the fan -- what then? If all else fails the govt will just put us to work like they did in the 30s.

WESTPARK THE KING OF ASMB

"westpark ran a train on this thread" - Stilgar

"Every woman needs a good slap now & again." - Sir Sean Connery
Order of the Kitty
KnightStar
Posts: 60,995
Registered: ‎07-21-2003
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63829531


NaBraniel wrote:

I feel similarly, although someone attempting to profit from economic predictions does not necessarily nullify those predictions.

 

 

I've been listening to the video drone on all this time and it finally dropped the always hilarious "THE LESS PEOPLE WHO KNOW ABOUT THIS THE BETTER" line.


It all goes back to the old saying, "There is a grain of truth in everything."

Still seems like an attempt to play on people's fears more than anything though.

TOMOE242004
"It is a journey into the male mind, in which I believe is really a potentially funny place cause lets face it, nothing happens there." -Andy Wilman Top Gear Producer-

"What will be will, what won't....won't." -Kamina-

"The only person that ever looked good in a four seated convertible was Adolph Hitler!" -Jeremy Clarkson-

"Ha! Sanity, what would I do with something as useless as that?" "Good thing I never had use for such a thing." -Zaraki Kenpatchi-

"I've never seen a ship like this before. It's far behind any C'tarl-C'tarl ship. It won't move unless you're naked! That's very kinky, wouldn't you say? -Aisha Clanclan-

"Well it was the least I could do for you, actually the least I could have done was run away and stick my head in a gopher hole." -Griffin Kato-

"Nothing good can ever come from staying with normal people." -Harry McDougal-


landstander
landstander
Posts: 31,705
Registered: ‎07-15-2004
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63829401

Cynicism is no way to sustain a society. Neither's simply hoping for things to get better.
Tramps like us...baby we were Born to Run
Swimmortal
westpark
Posts: 59,269
Registered: ‎10-26-2005
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to rotanalebor - Message ID#: 63829537


rotanalebor wrote:
Honestly, I think we're screwed. When adjusted for inflation Individual earnings for the majority of Americans have been stagnant for decades. While our country's GDP has grown substantially over that time almost all the gains went to the top few percent and income inequality is the worst since the Gilded Age as a result. The effects of this have been partially masked for a while by rising household income (as more members of the family entered the workforce), cheap credit, and relatively low price inflation, but I think we've reached the effective limit of these. Without some real and sustained growth in median wages I don't see how we can return to a healthy economy.

We're not facing apocalyptic scenario where we're all forced to horde water and grow our own food, but I can see 7-8% unemployment and low labor participation rates being the "new normal." Even if we do manage to somehow get back to full employment, we'll find ourselves increasingly becoming a nation of low-wage service employees with more and more of us relying on gov't assistance (tax credits, food stamps, insurance subsidies) just stay out of poverty.

I don't know how we turn the tide at this point, but the Republican cure-all, lowering taxes for rich, is ridiculous. 30 years of historically low taxes on income and capital gains for the richest Americans have brought us to where we are today. Plus they want to cut benefits for the poor and those on fixed incomes, AND they want to "broaden the base" by raising taxes on the poor? Yeah, reducing aggregate demand by the slashing discretionary income of those most likely to spend will surely get the economy booming! /sarcasm

I wish the Democrats actually had a plan for treating the disease instead of the symptoms. Obamacare, payroll tax cuts, and expanding food stamps and unemployment are all well and good in the short-term, but they don't address the long-term issues that make these programs necessary: the middle class is dying.

Excellent points. And when Obama talks about tax cuts -- you know the right has already shifted the debate to their side of the court.

 

This is why I call the current lot of Republicans anarcho-capitalists -- they are.literally trying to get rid of govt period.

 

You also are correct that the past 30 years were fueled by a MASSIVE credit expansion. The problem is -- people are borrowed out.

 

Until debt levels go down, the economy won't be coming back.

WESTPARK THE KING OF ASMB

"westpark ran a train on this thread" - Stilgar

"Every woman needs a good slap now & again." - Sir Sean Connery
Swimmortal
westpark
Posts: 59,269
Registered: ‎10-26-2005
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to KnightStar - Message ID#: 63829583

http://finance.fortune.cnn.com/2011/09/02/aftershock-finding-fort
une-in-marketing-doom/

 

 

Dug this up. Apparently doom & gloom is gold for these pricks. :smileyvery-happy:

 

Now they're millionaires from sales of the books....

WESTPARK THE KING OF ASMB

"westpark ran a train on this thread" - Stilgar

"Every woman needs a good slap now & again." - Sir Sean Connery
Reeve
NaBraniel
Posts: 29,913
Registered: ‎11-26-2004
0

Re: American decline.

[ Edited ]

Reply to westpark - Message ID#: 63829599

They're ambitious entrepreneurs! "How to make the bad economy work for you? Tell everyone you know how to make the bad economy work for you!"

 

 

I linkjumped from there to http://finance.fortune.cnn.com/2012/02/23/why-lower-corporate-tax
-rates-wont-help-the-u-s/
 which might have the worst opening paragraph I've ever seen on any remotely legitimate site. Just absolutely riddled with errors and failure.

Muslim brotherhood
Swimmortal
westpark
Posts: 59,269
Registered: ‎10-26-2005
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63829611


NaBraniel wrote:
They're ambitious entrepreneurs!


"How to make the bad economy work for you? Tell everyone you know how to make the bad economy work for you!"

Kinda scary how simple the logic is.

 

What's amazing is that they've had 100 million bucks flow into an investment fund they set up.

 

Then he said ' we wanna make a mutual fund' -- when I was in college a friend of mine who was majoring in finance was babbling about how that's what he wanted to do. Because say you get 500 million in assets -- you take a '2 percent service fee' for running said fund.

 

Well #### -- thats 10 million bucks a year....

WESTPARK THE KING OF ASMB

"westpark ran a train on this thread" - Stilgar

"Every woman needs a good slap now & again." - Sir Sean Connery
SwimPWNED
BackupAlt
Posts: 4,233
Registered: ‎12-20-2011
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to BackupAlt - Message ID#: 63829461

SwimIcon
rotanalebor
Posts: 10,022
Registered: ‎02-16-2004
0

Re: American decline.

[ Edited ]

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63829611

There are people taking advantage of gold bugs in the same way. They advertise all over the conservative talk radio stations in my area, hawking gold coins at a significant margin over their commodity price per ounce, and they justify it by implying that having the physical coins in hand means you REALLY own it rather than just owning gold on paper.

The thing is, though, even if you fear a post-apocalyptic situation where you're unable to redeem your paper stake in physical gold, good luck trading your gold coins for anywhere near pre-apocalyptic market value! You're better off hoarding guns and ammo, canned food, matches, water purification equipment... you know, things that would actually be useful and would, therefore, increase their value.

If (when) the commodities bubble bursts-- or, god help us, the apocalypse actually arrives-- these coin collectors are going to get the worst of it.
yes
SwimHELPeR
DoomsDayDevice
Posts: 12,319
Registered: ‎05-23-2008
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63829527


NaBraniel wrote:
Just a way of saying we have all of human history behind us to analyze and learn from. The human factor... will our large population of literate twenty-first century men and women, with our formal schooling and array of widely available information and ability to reason, be able to deftly avoid or navigate through future major societal problems and emerge as unscathed as one could reasonably hope for, or are we, despite all of our technological and humanitarian progression, not at a special enough time in human development to overcome the usual high hurdles of coexisting.

Oh, then, no, we can't all coexist with our fellow man, because when it comes right down to it, once humanity sees the beginnings of depletion of natural resources, wars between the "great nations" will start and everything will go down the toilet. I mean, look what's happening with Iran threatening to block the Strait of Hormuz and the international community's response to it.

IMMA RAIN HOT DOOM DOWN UPON YOU!


Visit The Pillow Fort


You're dead to me.

SwimIcon
Tempty_McHotstuff
Posts: 10,488
Registered: ‎03-25-2007
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to DoomsDayDevice - Message ID#: 63829479

:smileyvery-happy:!

 

doomy.

 

i see you assassinating that 1%

♡❤♡❤♡
Together Forever
SwimHELPeR
DoomsDayDevice
Posts: 12,319
Registered: ‎05-23-2008

Re: American decline.

Reply to Tempty_McHotstuff - Message ID#: 63829679

nah, i'll just melt some gold and make them drink it.

 

:smileylol:

IMMA RAIN HOT DOOM DOWN UPON YOU!


Visit The Pillow Fort


You're dead to me.

SwimIcon
Tempty_McHotstuff
Posts: 10,488
Registered: ‎03-25-2007
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to DoomsDayDevice - Message ID#: 63829711

you're a meanie mcmeanie face.

 

*hug*

 

it's ok, i still wub you bunches.

♡❤♡❤♡
Together Forever
Order of the Kitty
KnightStar
Posts: 60,995
Registered: ‎07-21-2003
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to westpark - Message ID#: 63829599


westpark wrote:

http://finance.fortune.cnn.com/2011/09/02/aftershock-finding-fort
une-in-marketing-doom/

 

 

Dug this up. Apparently doom & gloom is gold for these pricks. :smileyvery-happy:

 

Now they're millionaires from sales of the books....


Not surprising it being 2012 and all that, by the end of this year we will all wish we were blind and deaf because of all the Doom sayers coming out of the woods to get their ten minutes of glory.

TOMOE242004
"It is a journey into the male mind, in which I believe is really a potentially funny place cause lets face it, nothing happens there." -Andy Wilman Top Gear Producer-

"What will be will, what won't....won't." -Kamina-

"The only person that ever looked good in a four seated convertible was Adolph Hitler!" -Jeremy Clarkson-

"Ha! Sanity, what would I do with something as useless as that?" "Good thing I never had use for such a thing." -Zaraki Kenpatchi-

"I've never seen a ship like this before. It's far behind any C'tarl-C'tarl ship. It won't move unless you're naked! That's very kinky, wouldn't you say? -Aisha Clanclan-

"Well it was the least I could do for you, actually the least I could have done was run away and stick my head in a gopher hole." -Griffin Kato-

"Nothing good can ever come from staying with normal people." -Harry McDougal-


Swimperfect
Posts: 6,225
Registered: ‎03-01-2009
0

Re: American decline.

[ Edited ]

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63829401

GOOD SENSE, INNOCENCE CRIPPLIN' MAN KIND
DEAD KINGS
MANY THINGS
I CAN'T DEFINE
OCCASIONS, PERSUASIONS CLUTTER YOUR MIND
INCENSE, PEPPERMINTS, THE COLOR OF TIME

WHO CARES, WHAT GAMES WE CHOOSE?
LITTLE TO WIN
NOTHING TO LOSE!

INCENSE, PEPPERMINTS
MEANINGLESS NOUNS

TURN ON, TUNE IN, TURN YOUR EYES AROUND

LOOK AT YOURSELF
LOOK AT YOURSELF

YEAH
YEAH

LOOK AT YOURSELF
LOOK AT YOURSELF

YEAAAAAAH YEEEEEEAH YEEEAH YEAH

TO DIVIDE THE COCKEYED WORLD IN TWO
THROW YOUR PRIDE TO ONE SIDE
LEAST YOU CAN DO!

BEATNIKS AND POLITICS
NOTHING IS NEW

A YARDSTICK FOR LUNATICS
ONE POINT OF VIEW

WHO CARES
WHAT GAMES WE CHOOSE?

LITTLE TO WIN
NOTHING TO LOSE!

GOOD SENSE
INNOCENCE
CRIPPLE MANKIND

DEAD KINGS AND MANY THINGS
I CAN'T DEFINE

OCCASIONS, PERSUASIONS CLUTTER YOUR MIND

INCENSE AND PEPPERMINTS
THE COLOR OF TIME

WHO CARES WHAT GAMES WE CHOOSE?
LITTLE TO WIN, NOTHING TO LOSE!

SHA
LA
LA

SHA
LA
LA

sha
la
la

sha
la
laaaaaaaaaaaaa


I think Strawberry Alarm Clock just told us to fuuuuuudge it.
SwimHELPeR
DoomsDayDevice
Posts: 12,319
Registered: ‎05-23-2008

Re: American decline.

Reply to Tempty_McHotstuff - Message ID#: 63829723


Tempty_McHotstuff wrote:

you're a meanie mcmeanie face.

 

*hug*

 

it's ok, i still wub you bunches.


awww, yer gonna make me melt. :smileytongue:

 

or stiffen, i forget which. :smileyvery-happy:

 

and I was making an allusion to a book I read with that last comment. :smileywink:

IMMA RAIN HOT DOOM DOWN UPON YOU!


Visit The Pillow Fort


You're dead to me.

Reeve
NaBraniel
Posts: 29,913
Registered: ‎11-26-2004
0

Re: American decline.

Reply to rotanalebor - Message ID#: 63829667

Investing in gold/silver was more or less the crux of the video I just finished sitting through as well. The argument was "the dollar will be worthless soon (thanks in part to various past bubbles) so gold is only going to keep rapidly accelerating in value as it has been for awhile better get on board and invest now so you'll be RICH!"

 

It's not even a tax on cynics or the desperate as much as it is on the easily swayed.

 

"The easily swayed" is a pc term, I won't say what for.

 

Hearkening back to your first post, I can't disagree with your rationale or outlook but can posit : As things stagnate and decline, resources dwindle, and especially with the wealth disparity already being what it is and not likely to decrease anytime soon, I'm not sure if the general population (of this country, of the world) will stand by and just let it all be okay without ultimately leading to major reforms being instituted. As you said, neither political party has an applicable answer, if this continues (the same problems we've had for decades being exacerbated with no real change in sight) I see the government gearing itself more and more toward self-preservation, as the citizenry position themselves to instigate some sort of revolution. I'm not concerned about some completely broken down apocalypse and I don't see America fragmenting or anything particularly drastic, but I do think continuing to allow the wealthy ruling class look for a solution (and dominate the resources and forums necessary to find and implement one) to the problems (of everyone who isn't part of the wealthy ruling class) within the current global debt-based economic system in which we've entrenched ourselves and everyone who will be born is...what's the word...futile? Just altogether the wrong approach. 

 

Giant impossible figures of debt plaguing the richest and poorest nations alike, a staggering portion of the human population living in extreme poverty, no prioritizing of resources or development, no real mission statement from any company other than "Profit." It doesn't benefit anyone, any country or people, except a ridiculous few individuals on the planet, and I don't see what about that is worth preserving. "But it's been poorly working for this long" is not a reason. "It got us to the moon!" is not a reason. COMMUNIST SOCIALISM DERISIVELY IN ALL CAPS is not a reason. Maybe I'm being too pessimistic, or optimistic, but with we as a species facing daunting problems on a larger scale than anything we've seen just due to the sheer number of people alone, I hope people can work out some way of doing things that is more effective and imaginative then continuing to plug holes in a ship that's been sinking for a long time, or some metaphor that is actually apt.

 

 

Incidentally, re: "hoarding water," an approaching critical lack of fresh water in this country is one of the things I am staunchly tinfoil about.

Muslim brotherhood
Swimperfect
Posts: 6,225
Registered: ‎03-01-2009
0

Re: American decline.

[ Edited ]

Reply to NaBraniel - Message ID#: 63830367

gold is worthless if you think the dollar is going to be useless.

Might as well invest in gun and ammunition stockpiles and bulk up on necessities to barter with, soap, non-perishable food, etc

CAUSE WHEN #### GOES DOWN, GOLD IS WORTHLESS!