Reply
KittehStar
1938_Packard
Posts: 14,310
Registered: ‎08-09-2008
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to crapshot2 - Message ID#: 61571442


crapshot2 wrote:

you are not helping your stupid cause.... or actually I guess you are.


"The question in the first raid seemed to be whether Gibson had been buying illegally harvested hardwoods from protected forests, such as the Madagascar ebony that makes for such lovely fretboards."

 

- a direct quote from the link in the OP.

 

 

It's been established now that the Obama Adminstration is employing an armed force to protect trees in Madagascar but is not at all willing to send an armed force to protect people on American soil.  What's more, the jackbooted thugs charged with protecting foreign trees is being deployed on American soil and directed against American citizens.

 

It's the Gibson Guitar factory as of now.  One has too ask who is next.  You, maybe?  Because your boss's paper cups are imported and has minute traces of this tree's wood pulp?

 

Now I really do have to agree with Rush Limbaugh when he said that the single most beautiful thing about a tree is what you make out of it after you chop it down.

 

 

 

 

Logic dictates, that in the unlikely event that pro - gunners become as violent and destructive as the anti - gunners claim them to be, there would not be a solitary anti - gunner remaining.
KittehHotshot
crapshot2
Posts: 9,561
Registered: ‎04-14-2011
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to 1938_Packard - Message ID#: 61571948


1938_Packard wrote:

 

It's been established now that the Obama Adminstration is employing an armed force to protect trees in Madagascar but is not at all willing to send an armed force to protect people on American soil.

 

 



are you that ignorant? do you think they would make public terrorists counter measures? I sure hope NO administration does that

 

think about this and how **beast** stupid it is. you need to stop listening to idiots.

all hail the crimson king
KittehStar
Posts: 6,180
Registered: ‎02-17-2010
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to westpark - Message ID#: 61508088

Even workers are being threatened.

 

Federal agents first raided Gibson factories in November 2009 and were back again Aug. 24, seizing guitars, wood and electronic records. Gene Nix, a wood product engineer at Gibson, was questioned by agents after the first raid and told he could face five years in jail.

 

"Can you imagine a federal agent saying, 'You're going to jail for five years' and what you do is sort wood in the factory?" said Mr. Juszkiewicz, recounting the incident. "I think that's way over the top." Gibson employees, he said, are being "treated like drug criminals."



http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100014240531119038959045765429420
27859286.html


 

 

maybe that's how he got his wife :smileyvery-happy:

http://boards.adultswim.com/t5/Babbling/definition-of-rape-has-be
en-updated-by-the-U-S/m-p/63228589#M9189342

alucardsexyghost accusing me of being a rapist, and drugging my wife. Stay classy [AS]
KittehHotshot
crapshot2
Posts: 9,561
Registered: ‎04-14-2011
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to Astromang - Message ID#: 61576462

no one is suggesting that isn't over the top. people who are not involved should not be prosecuted even if the whomever ordered the wood is guilty of everything. the only person/people who should be punished are the people who are directly responsable.

all hail the crimson king
KittehStar
1938_Packard
Posts: 14,310
Registered: ‎08-09-2008
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to crapshot2 - Message ID#: 61578050


crapshot2 wrote:

no one is suggesting that isn't over the top. people who are not involved should not be prosecuted even if the whomever ordered the wood is guilty of everything. the only person/people who should be punished are the people who are directly responsable.


How about not having the stupid law in the first place?  It's friggin' tree, for crying out loud!  Chop one down and grow fifty new ones.  Who cares? 

 

Sheez, Gov is acting like the tree is God or something.  Somebody should tell the bozos who made the decision to raid that the movie, "Avatar" was only make pretend.

Logic dictates, that in the unlikely event that pro - gunners become as violent and destructive as the anti - gunners claim them to be, there would not be a solitary anti - gunner remaining.
Grumpy Cat
scoobdog
Posts: 26,814
Registered: ‎09-13-2003
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

[ Edited ]

Reply to 1938_Packard - Message ID#: 61583042

It wouldn't be rare wood if you could grow fifty new ones.

KittehStar
1938_Packard
Posts: 14,310
Registered: ‎08-09-2008
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

[ Edited ]

Reply to scoobdog - Message ID#: 61583070


scoobdog wrote:

It wouldn't be rare wood if you could grow fifty new ones.


Then keep cutting them until they are extinct.  We have better things to spend our time and resources on than protecting a tree that isn't even indigenous to this nation.  How about more funding to ensure that fire departments in THIS nation are fully staffed and have enough equipment?  Fire the whole team that conducted the Gibson raid and hire an equal number of fire fighters for a town that needs them.  And, forget all about trying to protect foreign trees.

Logic dictates, that in the unlikely event that pro - gunners become as violent and destructive as the anti - gunners claim them to be, there would not be a solitary anti - gunner remaining.
KittehStar
Posts: 6,180
Registered: ‎02-17-2010
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to scoobdog - Message ID#: 61583070


scoobdog wrote:

It wouldn't be rare wood if you could grow fifty new ones.


You could grow fifty new ones. All you need are sapplings or seeds. I wonder if the U.S. Department of Agriculture bans them from being grown in the U.S. for harvest.

maybe that's how he got his wife :smileyvery-happy:

http://boards.adultswim.com/t5/Babbling/definition-of-rape-has-be
en-updated-by-the-U-S/m-p/63228589#M9189342

alucardsexyghost accusing me of being a rapist, and drugging my wife. Stay classy [AS]
Grumpy Cat
scoobdog
Posts: 26,814
Registered: ‎09-13-2003
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to 1938_Packard - Message ID#: 61583182

Good plan, sport.

Grumpy Cat
scoobdog
Posts: 26,814
Registered: ‎09-13-2003
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to Astromang - Message ID#: 61583448


Astromang wrote:

scoobdog wrote:

It wouldn't be rare wood if you could grow fifty new ones.


You could grow fifty new ones. All you need are sapplings or seeds. I wonder if the U.S. Department of Agriculture bans them from being grown in the U.S. for harvest.


No, you need sapplings, seeds, water, adequately nutritious soil, appropriate climate to name just a few.  Also, the introduction of one species into a foreign eco system could potentially result in invasive growth that damages the existing flora.

 

The point is that these rare woods they speak of are found in restricted zones, such as rainforests.  Part of what makes them such beautiful woods aesthetically is the very specific environmental factors that impact the tree's growth.  That is not to say that the U.S. doesn't have some exclusive woods of it's own (Giant Redwood anyone?), but the woods we commonly think of for their exclusive properties are typically old growth (creating the density that makes them prized) and indigenous to specific climates.

KittehStar
1938_Packard
Posts: 14,310
Registered: ‎08-09-2008
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to Astromang - Message ID#: 61583448


Astromang wrote:

scoobdog wrote:

It wouldn't be rare wood if you could grow fifty new ones.


You could grow fifty new ones. All you need are sapplings or seeds. I wonder if the U.S. Department of Agriculture bans them from being grown in the U.S. for harvest.


Say, not a bad idea at all.  We just have to find out whether it's legal.  When it's illegal, have the law changed.

 

It's being done with other trees, isn't it?  The Fir for example.  It's a tree being culivated specifically for the purpose of construction lumber.  I don't seem to find fir on the endangered list.

 

 

Logic dictates, that in the unlikely event that pro - gunners become as violent and destructive as the anti - gunners claim them to be, there would not be a solitary anti - gunner remaining.
Grumpy Cat
scoobdog
Posts: 26,814
Registered: ‎09-13-2003
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

[ Edited ]

Reply to 1938_Packard - Message ID#: 61583872

That's because "fir" is a genus of trees, not a species.  Also species of  douglas fir are native to North America.

KittehStar
1938_Packard
Posts: 14,310
Registered: ‎08-09-2008
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

[ Edited ]

Reply to scoobdog - Message ID#: 61583904


scoobdog wrote:

That's because "fir" is a genus of trees, not a species.  Also species of  douglas fir are native to North America.


Ya know, we have spa in New Jersey where live palm trees are kept and maintained in doors for decorative reasons.  They remain as healthy and growing trees due to the various plant experts who artificially induce the conditions necessary for such vegetation to thrive, despite the fact that it's not at all indigenous to New Jersey.

 

With that said, why not transplant just twenty or thirty of the rare trees from Madagascar to Hawaii, Southern Florida or Southern California as an experiment to investigate the possibility of cultivation in the U.S.?  Gov does not stand to profit either itself or society as a whole in such a venture, however since the guitar merchants prize the wood, a private farmer could profit himself and his family through the cultivation by selling the resulting wood to the guitar merchant or perhaps even to furniture makers in the event the wood happens to be sturdy enough for furniture. 

 

By the way, I'm holding my grandfather's knife in my hand right now and its handle is made of ebony.  Am I about to get arrested?

Logic dictates, that in the unlikely event that pro - gunners become as violent and destructive as the anti - gunners claim them to be, there would not be a solitary anti - gunner remaining.
KittehStar
Posts: 6,180
Registered: ‎02-17-2010
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to scoobdog - Message ID#: 61583866


scoobdog wrote:

Astromang wrote:

scoobdog wrote:

It wouldn't be rare wood if you could grow fifty new ones.


You could grow fifty new ones. All you need are sapplings or seeds. I wonder if the U.S. Department of Agriculture bans them from being grown in the U.S. for harvest.


No, you need sapplings, seeds, water, adequately nutritious soil, appropriate climate to name just a few.  Also, the introduction of one species into a foreign eco system could potentially result in invasive growth that damages the existing flora.

 

Trees don't grow fast enough to be invasive.

 

The point is that these rare woods they speak of are found in restricted zones, such as rainforests.  Part of what makes them such beautiful woods aesthetically is the very specific environmental factors that impact the tree's growth.  That is not to say that the U.S. doesn't have some exclusive woods of it's own (Giant Redwood anyone?), but the woods we commonly think of for their exclusive properties are typically old growth (creating the density that makes them prized) and indigenous to specific climates.

 

This isn't true at all. What makes Ebony prized is because of its density that is specific to that tree type. What makes rosewood prized is the color and texture specific to that tree type. It doesn't matter where it's grown, so long that it can be grown there.


 

maybe that's how he got his wife :smileyvery-happy:

http://boards.adultswim.com/t5/Babbling/definition-of-rape-has-be
en-updated-by-the-U-S/m-p/63228589#M9189342

alucardsexyghost accusing me of being a rapist, and drugging my wife. Stay classy [AS]
Order of the Kitteh
Master-Debater131
Posts: 59,190
Registered: ‎06-20-2005
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

[ Edited ]

Reply to scoobdog - Message ID#: 61569434


scoobdog wrote:

Master-Debater131 wrote:

Greenpeace and other Enviromental groups are now coming out to defend Gibson on their record of Enviromental protection.

 

 

With each passing day more and more evidence comes out that makes this look like nothing more than a hit by the DOJ and a GOP donor. 

 


THis really is starting to smell like bull**beast** and investigations need to happen.  Hopefully Issa is starting to draw up the paperwork because this reeks of bull **beast**.


Wow, seriously?  You have anything on that?  (I'm not trying to be a **beast**, just curious as to what would drive this kind of vendetta).

 

Also, while I stand by what I said, I'm going to have to reverse course and say that this is a waste of government resources.  It sounds an awful lot like the government is going out of its way to set legal traps.  If what you're saying is true, this could be a case of corruption...



Go read my last few posts.  They show some evidence that this may be nothing but a political hit.

 

 

Im not claiming it is and if it appears that i am claiming thatn then I jumped to a conclusion a bit to soon and i appoligize.  All I am saying is evidence is coming out that makes it appear like a political hit.  Further investigation NEEDS to happen and hopefully Issa is in the process of throwing out paperwork to require the DOJ to explain themselves.

 

 

Also: Holder needs to go.  he has done nothing but turn the DOJ into a political tool and thats not what the DOJ should be.  DOJ appointees really shouldnt be political and Holder is.  He needs to go.


(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

Socialism is great until you run out of other peoples money. Just ask Greece
Ive got a lovely bunch of coconuts
KittehLegend
GiantMegaDoucheX
Posts: 23,314
Registered: ‎06-04-2004
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to westpark - Message ID#: 61508088

fuuuuuudge the FBI.

 

fuuuuuudge the DEA.

 

fuuuuuudge the FDA.

 

fuuuuuudge acronyms in general.

KittehHotshot
crapshot2
Posts: 9,561
Registered: ‎04-14-2011
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to 1938_Packard - Message ID#: 61583042


1938_Packard wrote:

crapshot2 wrote:

no one is suggesting that isn't over the top. people who are not involved should not be prosecuted even if the whomever ordered the wood is guilty of everything. the only person/people who should be punished are the people who are directly responsable.


How about not having the stupid law in the first place?  It's friggin' tree, for crying out loud!  Chop one down and grow fifty new ones.  Who cares? 

 



because when a tree is endangered that is not the case

all hail the crimson king
Grumpy Cat
scoobdog
Posts: 26,814
Registered: ‎09-13-2003
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to Astromang - Message ID#: 61584190


Astromang wrote:

scoobdog wrote:

Astromang wrote:

scoobdog wrote:

It wouldn't be rare wood if you could grow fifty new ones.


You could grow fifty new ones. All you need are sapplings or seeds. I wonder if the U.S. Department of Agriculture bans them from being grown in the U.S. for harvest.


No, you need sapplings, seeds, water, adequately nutritious soil, appropriate climate to name just a few.  Also, the introduction of one species into a foreign eco system could potentially result in invasive growth that damages the existing flora.

 

Trees don't grow fast enough to be invasive.

 

The point is that these rare woods they speak of are found in restricted zones, such as rainforests.  Part of what makes them such beautiful woods aesthetically is the very specific environmental factors that impact the tree's growth.  That is not to say that the U.S. doesn't have some exclusive woods of it's own (Giant Redwood anyone?), but the woods we commonly think of for their exclusive properties are typically old growth (creating the density that makes them prized) and indigenous to specific climates.

 

This isn't true at all. What makes Ebony prized is because of its density that is specific to that tree type. What makes rosewood prized is the color and texture specific to that tree type. It doesn't matter where it's grown, so long that it can be grown there.


 


What's not true?  All you did was rephrase what I said, essentially.  Ebony isn't grown in the United States because it can't  be grown in the United States - we don't have tropical rainforests outside of a few leeward areas in Hawaii.  Even if you could grow these trees in a greenhouse, It would take several decades for them to mature, making it cost prohibitive.  Sure it doesn't matter where it's grown, as long as the place is very nearly exactly like it's native habitat.

 

And, yes, a tree can be invasive.  It's not how fast it grows, it's how well it crowds out native plants.

Grumpy Cat
scoobdog
Posts: 26,814
Registered: ‎09-13-2003
0

Re: Feds raid Gibson guitar factory.....

Reply to 1938_Packard - Message ID#: 61584070


1938_Packard wrote:

scoobdog wrote:

That's because "fir" is a genus of trees, not a species.  Also species of  douglas fir are native to North America.


Ya know, we have spa in New Jersey where live palm trees are kept and maintained in doors for decorative reasons.  They remain as healthy and growing trees due to the various plant experts who artificially induce the conditions necessary for such vegetation to thrive, despite the fact that it's not at all indigenous to New Jersey.

 

With that said, why not transplant just twenty or thirty of the rare trees from Madagascar to Hawaii, Southern Florida or Southern California as an experiment to investigate the possibility of cultivation in the U.S.?  Gov does not stand to profit either itself or society as a whole in such a venture, however since the guitar merchants prize the wood, a private farmer could profit himself and his family through the cultivation by selling the resulting wood to the guitar merchant or perhaps even to furniture makers in the event the wood happens to be sturdy enough for furniture. 

 

By the way, I'm holding my grandfather's knife in my hand right now and its handle is made of ebony.  Am I about to get arrested?



Neither Florida not California has the right climate.  Hawaii does have rainforest, but it's in small pockets that are heavily protected - you couldn't cutlvate any trees in there without critically damaging the existing ecosystem.