Babbling

[Gaius_Sextus]

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The_Pirate-King wrote:

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Jingai wrote:

  The issue is complex, but in basic terms, the question now is; during the altercation which occurred

between Mr. Martin and Mr. Zimmerman, was the level of force used by Mr. Martin enough for a normal

person to reasonably believe his life was in imminent danger, and therefore justify defending himself with

lethal force. The police report indicated that Mr. Zimmerman sustained injury to his face and the back of his

head, and the eyewitness reports seeing Mr. Martin on top of Mr. Zimmerman and slamming his head onto

the sidewalk. I think the best thing really for all parties involved is to wait until the evidence is gathered

and assessed by the special prosecutor, because it is seeming like Mr. Zimmerman might well have

a case for self defense even absent the "stand your ground" law.

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Finally, someone who is actually SANE.

Yes, it should go before a prosecutor. I'd like to see a trial as well. I don't think there is enough evidence in support of Mr. Zimmerman's claims of self defense to justify not pressing charges.

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What evidence? The police didn't collect any evidence, it seems. Who the fuuuuuudge can convict someone on no evidence?

[Gaius_Sextus]

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Master-Debater131 wrote:

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Gaius_Sextus wrote:

Conservatives, Trying to Feel Better About Their Racism

A must-read, especially for those who want to expos the bullsh!t about all those "screenshots" another poster was bragging about . . . . .

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Zimmerman, a Registered Democrat since 2002

But do keep saying how this is all about a conservative hunting down a black kid.  Its amusing as hell to watch.

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And who the fuuuuuudge has been saying that, you #### liar? You #### #### have NOTHING to back up your ####, so you have to #### lie about EVERYTHING!

[Gaius_Sextus]

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The_Pirate-King wrote:
Who ever said Zimmerman was a conservative?

I didn't. I haven't seen anyone say that.


F*** off, polititroll.

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It should be F*** off, you #### lying poltitroll.

[Gaius_Sextus]

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Astromang wrote:

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Master-Debater131 wrote:

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Gaius_Sextus wrote:

Conservatives, Trying to Feel Better About Their Racism

A must-read, especially for those who want to expos the bullsh!t about all those "screenshots" another poster was bragging about . . . . .

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Zimmerman, a Registered Democrat since 2002

But do keep saying how this is all about a conservative hunting down a black kid.  Its amusing as hell to watch.

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lolled.

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Yeah, you would, because you also like making up sh!t that nobody has said.

[Astromang]

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Gaius_Sextus wrote:

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The_Pirate-King wrote:
Who ever said Zimmerman was a conservative?

I didn't. I haven't seen anyone say that.


F*** off, polititroll.

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It should be F*** off, you #### lying poltitroll.

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Looks like your jimmies are eternally rustled.

[Pinkfrog]

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scoobdog wrote:

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Astromang wrote:

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The_Pirate-King wrote:
I thought that was obvious. But yes, the only reason conservatives care at all about this case is because they want to pretend racism isn't still deadly.

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Racism can be deadly. The sickening part about this case is that it's being built into a monster. You don't hear the media getting into a frenzy about that 13 year old set on fire with gasoline because he was white.

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That's because there aren't a whole lot of thirteen year old white kids who get set on fire.  You seem to want to deemphasize the race element, and that's fine, but the reason it blows up like this is because black people are still underserved.  They are under employed, they are dispraportionally represented in the Prison systems, and they are constantly under threat to lose the support systems they rely on to survive.  You know what sickens me?  That there is even one race out there that has the continual prospects of being poor and hopeless.  Don't blame the media for fanning the flames of malcontence when it's been there all along.

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I had a long post but it would just get trolled so I'll say this

You know god dam well why the white kid set on fire or something like this doesn't get the attention of Jessie Jackson or any of the attention whores..

http://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta/1-dead-1-wounded-1260418.html

http://www.ajc.com/news/cobb/15-shootings-in-three-940463.html

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-07-15/us/georgia.atlanta.shooting_1_
triple-shooting-police-arrest-parki...

This isn't new. The motive was stupidity and ignorance with a splash of crazy that he thought his life was in danger to the point to kill someone. I wasn't there the reports have not been released so then again wtf do I know other than conjecture at this point. Do I think Zimmerman thought.. Hey there is a black kid I think I'll kill him because of the color of his skin.. Not right now with the info out. Horrible sht happens and it isn't always because the reason YOU want it to be.

As for the prison system yea its fked up I wont argue with you on that it is bottom line.

That said what do you mean when you say this "they are disproportionably represented in the Prison systems"

[sleepyirv]

I mean, if they can't follow a very simple conversation they're having on a cartoon message board without drawing insane conclusions not backed by the evidence; how can we expect them to follow a murder case?

I'm shocked they don't think George Zimmerman is Santa Claus because he wore a red sweater.

[Pinkfrog]

what offical evidence has been released by the police department there?
All i have heard is ear testimony not much physical stuff..

According to the Sentinel, here is what police disclosed to the newspaper:

Zimmerman was on his way to a grocery store when he saw Martin walking through his gated community.

Martin was visiting his father's fiancee, who lived there. Zimmerman called police and reported a suspicious person, describing Martin as black, acting strangely and perhaps on drugs.

Zimmerman got out of his SUV to follow Martin on foot. When a dispatch employee asked Zimmerman whether he was following the teenager, Zimmerman said yes. The dispatcher told Zimmerman he did not need to do that.

There is about a one-minute gap during which police say they're not sure what happened.

Zimmerman told them he had lost sight of Martin and was walking back to his SUV when Martin approached him from the left rear, and they exchanged words. Martin asked Zimmerman whether he had a problem. Zimmerman said no and reached for his cell phone, he told police.

Martin then said, "Well, you do now" or something similar and punched Zimmerman in the nose.

Zimmerman fell, and Martin got on top of him and began slamming his head into the sidewalk, Zimmerman told police. Zimmerman began yelling for help.

Several witnesses heard those cries, and there has been a dispute about from whom they came: Zimmerman or Martin.

Attorneys for Martin's family say Martin was the one yelling, but police say their evidence indicates it was Zimmerman. One witness, who has since talked to local television news reporters, told police he saw Zimmerman on the ground with Martin on top, pounding him, and the witness was unequivocal that it was Zimmerman who was crying for help.

Zimmerman then shot Martin once in the chest from very close range, authorities said, according to the Sentinel.

When police arrived less than two minutes later, Zimmerman was bleeding from the nose, had a swollen lip and had bloody cuts on the back of his head. Paramedics gave him first aid, but he said no to going to the hospital. He got medical care the next day.

[Gaius_Sextus]

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Gaius_Sextus wrote:

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Master-Debater131 wrote:

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Gaius_Sextus wrote:

Conservatives, Trying to Feel Better About Their Racism

A must-read, especially for those who want to expos the bullsh!t about all those "screenshots" another poster was bragging about . . . . .

---

Zimmerman, a Registered Democrat since 2002

But do keep saying how this is all about a conservative hunting down a black kid.  Its amusing as hell to watch.

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And who the fuuuuuudge has been saying that, you #### liar? You #### #### have NOTHING to back up your ####, so you have to #### lie about EVERYTHING!

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http://shakespearessister.blogspot.com/2012/03/trayvon-martin-upd
ates_28.html

[Pinkfrog]

Better link

http://shakespearessister.blogspot.com/2010/01/feminism-101.html

[scoobdog]

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Pinkfrog wrote:

I had a long post but it would just get trolled so I'll say this

You know god dam well why the white kid set on fire or something like this doesn't get the attention of Jessie Jackson or any of the attention whores..

http://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta/1-dead-1-wounded-1260418.html

http://www.ajc.com/news/cobb/15-shootings-in-three-940463.html

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-07-15/us/georgia.atlanta.shooting_1_
triple-shooting-police-arrest-parki...

This isn't new. The motive was stupidity and ignorance with a splash of crazy that he thought his life was in danger to the point to kill someone. I wasn't there the reports have not been released so then again wtf do I know other than conjecture at this point. Do I think Zimmerman thought.. Hey there is a black kid I think I'll kill him because of the color of his skin.. Not right now with the info out. Horrible sht happens and it isn't always because the reason YOU want it to be.

As for the prison system yea its fked up I wont argue with you on that it is bottom line.

That said what do you mean when you say this "they are disproportionably represented in the Prison systems"

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It isn't Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton's fault either.  They may be pandering, but they aren't the source of this any more than the media is.  And, you're right in saying it's the reason that each of us wants it to be because situations like this reflect personal issues we each have.  Do I really think that protestors in LA really care about Trayvon all the way on the opposite coast?  No.  But, they do care about their own children and the same kind of problems they all face here because of their race.  And, while Jackson and Sharpton certainly have the potential to fan flames, they're probably more beneficial than anything in situations like this because they coaelsce all of this fear and anger that percolates other places and focus it into a common and, dare I say, constructive outlet.

[anDaibhalsHusair]

That sounds about as factual as we can accept for the time being. I'm willing to believe the shooting was entirely out of sepf defense. But the fact also remains that zimmerman created that situation. I'd like to say it will be interesting to see how it plays out In court, but I wont hold my breath for conclusive evidence to miraculously appear for either side. That opportunity is long gone and you cant get it back.

[candiegrlcane]

What do you mean by "how it plays out in court". Have charges even been pressed yet?

[The_Pirate-King]

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Pinkfrog wrote:

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scoobdog wrote:

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Astromang wrote:

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The_Pirate-King wrote:
I thought that was obvious. But yes, the only reason conservatives care at all about this case is because they want to pretend racism isn't still deadly.

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Racism can be deadly. The sickening part about this case is that it's being built into a monster. You don't hear the media getting into a frenzy about that 13 year old set on fire with gasoline because he was white.

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That's because there aren't a whole lot of thirteen year old white kids who get set on fire.  You seem to want to deemphasize the race element, and that's fine, but the reason it blows up like this is because black people are still underserved.  They are under employed, they are dispraportionally represented in the Prison systems, and they are constantly under threat to lose the support systems they rely on to survive.  You know what sickens me?  That there is even one race out there that has the continual prospects of being poor and hopeless.  Don't blame the media for fanning the flames of malcontence when it's been there all along.

---

I had a long post but it would just get trolled so I'll say this

You know god dam well why the white kid set on fire or something like this doesn't get the attention of Jessie Jackson or any of the attention whores..

http://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta/1-dead-1-wounded-1260418.html

http://www.ajc.com/news/cobb/15-shootings-in-three-940463.html

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-07-15/us/georgia.atlanta.shooting_1_
triple-shooting-police-arrest-parki...

This isn't new. The motive was stupidity and ignorance with a splash of crazy that he thought his life was in danger to the point to kill someone. I wasn't there the reports have not been released so then again wtf do I know other than conjecture at this point. Do I think Zimmerman thought.. Hey there is a black kid I think I'll kill him because of the color of his skin.. Not right now with the info out. Horrible sht happens and it isn't always because the reason YOU want it to be.

As for the prison system yea its fked up I wont argue with you on that it is bottom line.

That said what do you mean when you say this "they are disproportionably represented in the Prison systems"

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What's your point, that people get shot all the time?

See the thing is, generally in those cases it's not a grown-ass man shooting a child. And generally the police press charges. I notice a lot of words like "arrest" and "suspect" and "investigation" in those articles, but the police took the easy road with the Trayvon Martin case. Or so they thought.

As far as the whole race issue, I don't know WHY you find it so hard to believe Zimmerman was motivated by race. The guy used what very well might have been a racial slur in his 911 call, and he called 911 to report black kids in his area all the time. Then he said "these as​​​​sholes always get away", implying he wouldn't let that happen this time. It also seems like the most logical explanation for why he'd consider Martin a threat. Would he have to be a card carrying KKK member for you to take this #### seriously?

There was definitely a time in this country when white men in white neighborhoods considered it their civic duty to keep black people out of their neighborhood. Not necessarily to hunt them down and kill them (although that did happen), but to make sure their neighborhood was "safe". It seems very likely to me that Zimmerman had that kind of attitude, and that that was the reason he approached Martin, even if it wasn't the reason he killed him.

Once again, why you think that's so far-fetched is beyond me.

[Gaius_Sextus]

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anDaibhalsHusair wrote:
That sounds about as factual as we can accept for the time being. I'm willing to believe the shooting was entirely out of sepf defense. But the fact also remains that zimmerman created that situation. I'd like to say it will be interesting to see how it plays out In court, but I wont hold my breath for conclusive evidence to miraculously appear for either side. That opportunity is long gone and you cant get it back.

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Zimmerman created that situation the instant he told the police dispatcher he was following Martin, and the dispatcher told him, "We don't need you to do that" and he didn't get his ass back into his car and leave Trayvon alone.

[anDaibhalsHusair]

Candi: no charges. If they do decide thwy have sufficient cause to file them, I'm sure we all would know within seconds given the publicity. But Im speaking more from a what if. Even if no charges are ever filed through the criminal process, there is nothing to prevent a civil suit of wrongful death. Not that I have any reason to think that might happen either. But I do predict the stand your ground law being challenged directly If no amendments are made.

Gaius: glad we're on the same page.

[fugglesss]

all i know is as soon as its official that a man can shoot someone, claim self defense and get off scot free - things are going to get nasty

[Gaius_Sextus]

Who’s asleep at the wheel at The Daily Texan?

[crapshot2]

ABC news releases police video.

no bruises or anything that shows a fight. no headwound that should of required several stiches.

[fugglesss]

i  am not surprised at. all.

[Gaius_Sextus]

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crapshot2 wrote:

ABC news releases police video.

no bruises or anything that shows a fight. no headwound that should of required several stiches.

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Well, to be fair, no one said that the injuries on the back of Zimmerman's head required stiches, but there seems to be no sign of any physical trauma at all, not even blood on his, may I point out, light-colored shirt. I wish someone would explain to me how one can have a bloody, or according to one of Zimmerman's various stories, a broken nose, and not get a single drop of blood on the front his shirt.

[alucardsexyghost]

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Astromang wrote:

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Saddy wrote:
"Mary Cutcher, a witnesses to the shooting, told WFTV-Channel 9 in a Wednesday report that police took only a short statement from her, despite repeated attempts to share what she saw at length.

"I said, 'I know this was not self-defense. There was no punching, no hitting going on at the time, no wrestling,'" Cutcher said, adding that she felt the police investigating the shooting "blew us off."".

so no. not all of the witnesses are not saying it was self defense. most are saying the exact opposite.

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Police spokesman Sgt. Dave Morgenstern on Thursday issued a statement disputing Cutcher's version of events, calling her statements to WFTV "inconsistent with her sworn testimony to police."

"Actually officers who were canvassing the neighborhood looking for potential witnesses, the evening of the shooting, contacted her and she said she did not want to get involved," Morgenstern said.

From the video I posted earlier, the next day after the shooting the guy who witnessed it said Martin was on top of Zimmerman fighting with him.

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If the police were blowing off witnesses you think they would of admit it? So it's kind of a he said/she said kind of situation isn't it?

And since a few witnesses came forwad saying Martin was the one calling for help I'm leaning towards the witness over the police telling the truth.

That being said were you upset that you weren't geting the confentration you want so you decided to take the postition that it was the kid's fault?

[alucardsexyghost]

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Astromang wrote:

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Saddy wrote:
and there are also reports of police trying to get witnesses to change what they originally said as well as claiming that witnesses whose statements didn't agree with what they [the police] wanted to hear didn't want to cooperate.

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That doesn't make much sense, why would the guy interviewed the day after outright lie? The police I don't believe, but someone who was right there when it happened is a different story.

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why would the other witnesses that say the oppisite have out right lied?

[alucardsexyghost]

See even if martin had comeback and started the fight. Even if he was on top of the Zimmerman fighting him as one witness claims (while other witnesses disagree). Zimmerman had at least 100 pounds on the kid, how hard would it of been to get out from under him and just pin him? Why did he have to use a gun? That's my problem with it.

I'll accept that the other witnesses heard zimmerman and just thought they heard martin, I'll accept that for whatever reason a kid who was telling a friend on the phone he was scared of someone following him went back to confront him. What I have trouble accepting is that someone that much bigger then a kid had to use a gun to get out from under him.

[LadyMiseryAli]

New video of Zimmerman in cuffs, but guess what? No visible injuries!

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-naw-zimmerman-v
ideo-20120329,0,6127197.story